S4 E10 Unlocking Emotional Fluency With Raquel Deluccia
Jun 12, 2024
Welcome back to "The Crazy Ex-Wives Club"! In today's episode, we're thrilled to have Raquel Deluccia, a licensed marriage and family therapist, join us for an enlightening conversation. Raquel delves deep into the transformative powers of EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing) therapy, which aids in processing disturbing memories and emotions.
Together, we explore the fascinating concepts of the Inner Family Systems (IFS) modality, and Raquel shares personal insights into how past trauma and different parts of our inner selves influence present behaviors. Erica Bennett, your host, opens up about her own journey through divorce, touching on themes of societal pressures, shame, and self-blame.
In this heartfelt discussion, we tackle the complex emotions surrounding loss and grief, particularly in the context of divorce and co-parenting. Raquel provides invaluable advice on self-compassion, breaking generational patterns, and navigating life’s uncertainties. Whether you’re in the midst of a separation or simply seeking emotional healing, this episode offers tools, wisdom, and a sense of community. Stay tuned, and don’t forget to check out the show notes for more resources and details on Raquel’s course offerings.
Learn more about this week’s guest: Raquel Deluccia
Raquel DeLuccia, MA, LMFT is a licensed therapist and owner of InnerBloom Therapy Services, a private practice in Phoenix AZ. She hosts a podcast called Feel and Find Out where she shares her clinical insights and lived experience on how our relationship to our emotions impact every aspect of our lives. Her mission is to help you build emotional fluency so that you can connect to yourself and in your relationships. She is a single mom of 2 boys ages 14 and 4 from 2 different relationships and is currently in a relationship with a partner who is not their parent. She is passionate about helping single parents, coparents and blended families adjust to their new normal.
Want to grab your copy of The Origins of You by Vienna Sharon? Click HERE
Unlocking Emotional Fluency: Raquel Delucia on Therapy Techniques and Healing After Divorce FULL TRANSCRIPTS
Erica Bennett [00:00:00]:
We've talked about it before, we've tiptoed into it before, and you've heard me mention how many times. I just was surprised at the grief that continued to show up throughout the divorce process. It was obvious that I was going to have to grieve the loss of my marriage or the dreams I had with that husband. But there were so many other types of loss that showed up. And on today's episode, we have a guest who's going to help us navigate those feelings of loss and how do we come to terms with those big emotions? So let's get started. Welcome to the Crazy Ex Wives Club, a podcast dedicated to helping women navigate the emotional journey that is divorce. I'm your host, Erica, and if you're trying to figure out life after the big d, welcome to the club. Whether you're contemplating divorce or dealing with the aftermath or any of the many phases in between, the club has got you covered.
Erica Bennett [00:00:58]:
Each week you'll hear stories from women who have been in your shoes. This isn't about spilling tea and divorce details. This is about giving you the tools to take control of your own healing journey. Listen in weekly for advice, tips, and tools to help you move through each stage of the process. Hello and welcome back to another episode of the Crazy Ex Wives Club. I'm your host, Erica, and today I have Raquel Delucia with us. Raquel is a licensed marriage and family therapist. She holds a fabulous podcast called Feel and Find out.
Erica Bennett [00:01:33]:
And today we're going to navigate the choppy waters of the emotions around loss. So welcome, Raquel. I'm excited to have you here.
Raquel Deluccia [00:01:41]:
Hi, Erica. I'm so thrilled to be here. Can't wait to chat about this with you.
Erica Bennett [00:01:46]:
Absolutely. You know, when it comes to the emotions that one has to deal with, you can't argue that every facet of either moving through the phases when your marriage is troubled, to the separation, to the divorce, is truly led by big emotions. And when we don't take the time to feel them, to heal them, to move through them, it's when they continue to show up and bite us in the ass years later. So I'm excited to explore this topic with you and to give our listeners some tools on what they can do when they show up.
Raquel Deluccia [00:02:20]:
Yes, yes, absolutely.
Erica Bennett [00:02:22]:
So often they show up and they're so big and we want to run from them. And I love, love a good therapy healing session. Like, if something hurts, my friends laugh. If something, I'm like, ooh, that hurt. I am like a dog on a bone. I want to gnaw on it, I want to look at it. I want to get into it.
Erica Bennett [00:02:39]:
And I still found myself in moments where I felt so overwhelmed, I just couldn't handle anymore. I couldn't think about, like, oh, my gosh, I have to grieve the loss of something else. I have to learn to live without something else again. And it was hard sometimes to be able to look at it. So where do you find people struggle most when it comes to loss?
Raquel Deluccia [00:03:05]:
So if we look at different stages of the process, say, for instance, we're working with a woman who has just left her husband, and she knows it's the right move. She knows it's what's best for her. But there's this other part of her that is considering, is this the right choice? That second guessing comes up? These feelings are so big. I wake up fine one day. Hours later, I'm sobbing. I'm focusing on only the positives. And then I'm like, wait a minute, should I get him back? Like, should I try again? And so those questions come up a lot in that early phase.
Erica Bennett [00:03:46]:
I feel like I just got seen, like, like, called out, and it was so confusing. That's kind of what made me feel a little bit like, am I crazy right now? Have I lost my mind? Because how can I be all one direction and then the next direction in all over the place? So it's good to hear. That's the normal process.
Raquel Deluccia [00:04:06]:
Totally. And I normalize that for my clients all the time. It's going to be an emotional roller coaster. You will feel confident and strong and empowered with the decision in one moment, the next year, falling apart and questioning everything. So I like to look at it in terms of using a therapy model where let's meet the part of you that is empowered and confident and ready, and let's meet the part of you that is terrified and devastated because they feel different. They show up differently in the body. They have different roles in our lives. And that provides a lot of relief, I think, for the clients.
Raquel Deluccia [00:04:47]:
Be like, oh, yeah, okay. It's not, it's not like I'm the crazy one. I just have these different parts. So I would say that that's one phase where I see it.
Erica Bennett [00:04:57]:
I love that, too, because I don't think I've ever, I don't think I've ever looked at it that way. In terms of really bringing two completely different facets of who I am. I think I do it a lot individually. You know, we go and we do. I love a little deep inner childhood, wounding, healing right. And a good journey inside my mind, and I find the little young version of me and I talk to her, and it is that same idea. But looking at you in the present moment, that in this present moment, there are two facets of yourself, and that it's okay to hold space for the duality of both being excited for what is coming and being hurt and emotional and upset about what you're having to let go. And I think that fear of the uncertainty, did I do the right thing if I'm having these feelings? I was so excited yesterday.
Erica Bennett [00:05:49]:
I knew that this was the right choice. I made the choice, and now I'm having all these feelings. Did I make a mistake? Did I not know what I needed to do? So what happened? What can they do? What can you do when you're in those moments of second guessing?
Raquel Deluccia [00:06:03]:
I would say the answer is, you have to have compassion for that part that is questioning it, the part that's just so scared about what's on the other side of this, the unknowns of this. You know your life with this person, you know, the hard stuff, and you've adapted to living that way. You've adapted to the relationship, even if it's unhealthy, toxic, even if it's abusive, harmful. Like, that is your normal. And so envisioning a different life outside of that is terrifying. And I just want people to be like, oh, wow. Yeah, it is terrifying. This is new.
Raquel Deluccia [00:06:39]:
It's okay that I have that fear. It doesn't have to impact my next move, my decision.
Erica Bennett [00:06:46]:
I used to spend time rationalizing why my fears weren't logical. You know, like, why. Why are you so upset and hurt that there was lies. Why are you so, you knew that was the truth, right? Logically, I knew the facts around what was declining or going wrong in the marriage or the places that everybody would be like, that's a pretty big red flag, you know, if you're not working, if you're not both choosing to work together, if you're not willing to have the conversations, these things that. That happen, they're not crazy, outrageous, but they are things that happen in the way that people deal with things. And so I think being able to acknowledge them, accept them, some of my biggest healing moments just came for me in that moment of being upset, of looking at it and saying, yeah, Erica, that sucked. That was really scary, and that was really painful, and that was valid that you felt that way and you got through it and you're stronger and you know how to handle it now. So those old ghosts don't have to haunt you anymore, but sometimes it just takes stopping and looking at it and agree with it.
Erica Bennett [00:07:59]:
Tell it that it's right. Those things, they hurt. They suck. They were big, you guys. They're really big. And that helped to alleviate a lot of its strength for me.
Raquel Deluccia [00:08:09]:
Yeah, giving it space is huge for me. I always say, like, let's. Let's make some room for this part of you, for this emotion, because oftentimes people are like, I just. I don't want to feel this way anymore, and I don't want to feel like I'm. I made a mistake or lonely. It's a big one. Um, I don't want to feel doubt. So you know what I'll do? I'll reach out to my ex.
Raquel Deluccia [00:08:33]:
I'll go back. I'll do whatever I can to make it work, because they're trying to avoid and escape that discomfort, and that's probably the worst thing you could do. So I'm like, let's. Let's lean into it. Let's make room for it. Let's just see what it needs from you. It probably just needs a little room to exist, to be honored, to be validated. That's a really powerful word.
Raquel Deluccia [00:08:54]:
When I say to my. My clients, like, hey, this makes sense. You're not meant to just be full steam ahead. Everything's fine. Like, this was a whole life that is now shifting. This was a partnership, a relationship, a dynamic, and it will be no more. And it's now up to you to make new dynamics, relationships within yourself and then outside of that, with others. So, yeah, make space.
Erica Bennett [00:09:21]:
The mind definitely likes to create a lot of stories of if it gets worse. Even now, I still call myself out on the fear of the other shoe is going to drop. And when you've had something that really was. The reality of the other shoe was going to drop. My marriage was struggling. I knew that that was a reality for me. And then when it was, I love you, but I'm not in love with you, and I don't want to work on it, the whole world collapsed, and. And so having that constant fear is, what if it gets worse again? What if it gets worse again? And so I play a game that comes up, right? You acknowledge it, you validate it, but then I say, and what if it works out? What if that isn't what happened? What if? So we play the what if game a lot.
Erica Bennett [00:10:13]:
Every time you're spiraling and you're worried, you know, with my son, with my partner, you know, we get down this track of being concerned. Something is going to go so wrong. And we're future tripping. We're projecting out into the future of things that aren't a reality yet, and we're worried about them. And I'm like, what if? How big is big? How amazing of a what if can you create that could maybe kind of magically come to life for you? Play the what if game. I think the other thing that helped me feel normal, if that's. If that's a word, I mean, I don't really strive to be normal. I strive to be a little extra in all aspects of my life.
Erica Bennett [00:10:51]:
But I remember years after the divorce, these little pockets would show up of the grief, of the loss, of the bitterness, of the resentment, of the woe is me, right? Like, how dare this happen to me? My life's already been so hard. Why do I have to keep having these struggles? And I would go sign up for another consultation, and I'd go think I need to find another expert. And I'd go be like, oh, there must be a layer of healing that I haven't gotten to yet. And I remember one of those therapists saying, this is always going to be there. You already know what to do. There's not a new trick, there's not a new therapy thing that needs to happen. You know, the process, validate it, look at it, feel it, and then let it go and move to the. To the future.
Erica Bennett [00:11:39]:
But I think I was scared that it was always going to feel this big or that when it started, I was afraid it was going to get as big as it used to be. So that comment that you said that people come in and they're just like, I don't want to feel this way anymore. We think that if we look at it and deal with it and talk about it, it's going to get big again. And sometimes it's that process of finally releasing it, you know, giving you the space to move it forward into something else.
Raquel Deluccia [00:12:09]:
Yeah.
Erica Bennett [00:12:11]:
So what happens if we're looking at loss? Right? What are some of, let's put some, let's put some examples of loss out there, because I think it comes so quickly for us to think about, okay, we lost a person. For me, I lost a person. I lost the dream of a second child that I wanted. I lost the dream of a 50 year wedding anniversary that I had watched my grandparents go through. I, you know, there were these little pieces, but there are so many other ways that loss is sneaky. And it shows up in there so what are some of the ones that you see in your practice?
Raquel Deluccia [00:12:51]:
So if we look at, you know, someone who's divorced and shares a child with their ex. So you're co parenting. One thing that sneaks up on people is these events, you know, especially if your kids are little, when you separate, then your kids go to school, then your kids have dance recitals, sporting events, and you don't anticipate that feeling of, oh, wait, we're not doing this together. We're not sitting together. We're not going to get ice cream after, you know, whose night is it? How is that going to impact the one who has to leave and go home alone? How does it impact the kid who's like, wait a minute, why can't I be with whichever? And that is not something I know that I anticipated when I went through it. And that really hit me when it was happening. And a lot of clients come in, so I would say events, events that you don't think about. The birthday parties, holidays, holidays are a.
Erica Bennett [00:13:48]:
Big one and you just reminded me, or just popped up, even something as simple as, there will never be another person who you can have just a deep conversation about both loving your child the same amount. Because the way that, you know, the parents love their kid is different than grandparents or friends or aunts, uncle, step parents. It's just different. Like, I think about all the times I would then find a video of my son when he was a baby, right? And I'd be like, oh, this cute moment. And then you didn't have somebody to share that moment with anymore. That. That those events, too, were surprising to me.
Raquel Deluccia [00:14:29]:
Very. That's spot on.
Erica Bennett [00:14:31]:
I think another one for me would be there's an amount of grieving around your relationship. Can't go back to what it was. You know, if you're in that separated phase and you guys are still working on it and you're trying to figure out what it was, it doesn't matter what the end result is. You know, the marriage works out. Your marriage is not the same as it was before it went through this hurdle. And so you have to grieve the loss of that innocence. I had to grieve the loss of the, like, rose colored glasses that I was looking at life through and at love through. You know, I still am a big romantic, but it's.
Erica Bennett [00:15:10]:
It's a little more real now when your heart gets broken and the law and the trust is lost completely.
Raquel Deluccia [00:15:16]:
And I think you look at things through a different lens. You know, if you came from a home a family of origin where your parents were married, maybe still are married, versus a home where your parents were divorced. For me, my parents were divorced. So I was like, oh, I'm never doing that. I'm never having a kid and sharing it ever. Then I did it twice.
Erica Bennett [00:15:40]:
Not once, but twice. Repeating those family lessons until you get it right.
Raquel Deluccia [00:15:46]:
Yeah. And so it was like I had to deal with the loss of being able to say, oh, I did it differently because I really didn't. And now the more I understand about, you know, generational patterns and trauma, I'm like, well, yeah, of course I didn't do it differently, but that hope in me was always there.
Erica Bennett [00:16:03]:
Yeah, let's dive into those generational patterns, because I think people talk about it a lot, you know? Well, no, I think what people talk about is there's a bunch of reels and a bunch of memes out there, like, whoo, look at you breaking your generational trauma, but nobody actually tells you. What does that mean? What does it look like? What does it feel like? Because it isn't just, I did it different than my parents. It's deeper than that.
Raquel Deluccia [00:16:28]:
Oh, yeah. So even if we just talk about how emotions and emotional responses are passed down, like, one thing I focus on a lot is one's emotional origin story. Like, what did you see in your family? How did they process their feelings, share them, you know, receive them, talk about them? And, you know, my mom was. I'm from an italian family, and everybody's real loud and intense and reactive and big, and I never liked that. When I would get yelled at, I'm like, I'll never. That's not me. I'm not gonna do that. And here I am.
Raquel Deluccia [00:17:04]:
I have a teenager, and when he pushes those buttons, like, I'm literally. I become my mother. And I'm just like, wait a minute. To me, that is a generational pattern that was passed down, and that's how her mother and father was. And these are subconscious things, because consciously I'm like, oh, hell no, I'm not going to ever do that. But it's quick. And so that's one example of it. It can go deeper, all the way back to things that your great grandparents experienced can get passed down biologically and genetically through your mom, your grandparent.
Raquel Deluccia [00:17:40]:
And so you can feel the impact of certain things and not really understand why. That's very real. There's a lot of research done on that, but I hope that kind of answers the question. Yeah.
Erica Bennett [00:17:50]:
Because I think when it comes to doing the work, it's always you guys. It's always about, you know, like, #dothework. I literally just bought a t - shirt that was like, do the work. It comes down to be in the moment. Make the choice. Don't react to it.
Raquel Deluccia [00:18:08]:
The choice.
Erica Bennett [00:18:09]:
The choice. You always, always, always have a conscious choice. You have a choice on how you want to feel. You have a choice on how you want to act. You have a choice on how you want to show up. And so to break those patterns, it means that in the moment when you're going to subconsciously go to the habit that's already formed, when you're just going to move through the motions that you always do, whether you created them, whether you've watched them be modeled since you were young, whether it's just the way your family has always done it. The work is catching yourself. Catching yourself to make a different choice.
Erica Bennett [00:18:44]:
And, you know, when you first start doing the work, you're catching yourself. Might just be enough that after it happens, you're like, oh, that was the thing. That was the thing. That's the thing I didn't want to do. And as you get a little bit better now, you're in the moment. You can feel. I remember I'd be like, this is the moment, Erica, where you are not supposed to turn and lose your shit and yell. And then I'd be like, but it's just going to feel so good, and I just have to do it.
Erica Bennett [00:19:07]:
And I'd steamroll right through it. And eventually I got, oh, okay, take a break, walk away, calm down. And I'd go in the other room, I'd do my breathing. I'd calm down. I'd be like, okay, logically, I can come back to this conversation calmly, and I'd walk back in the room and meet their energy again and go right back down the slippery slope, you know? But little by little, little by little, each time you become more aware of, oh, I am making this choice. Is this still the choice I want to make? And when you do the work, it means you've made a different choice. And eventually that new choice becomes the new habit, becomes the new pattern, becomes the new second nature. And that's when you can really rewire these patterns as generational trauma, the trauma from your relationship, all of it.
Erica Bennett [00:19:56]:
Do the work. Make the choice. Hey, there, it's Erika, your guide at the Crazy ex Wives Club. I want to take a moment to express how much your feedback means to us. Your ratings, your reviews, they are like fuel for our journey together. They not only brighten our day, but they help other women find the support and the guidance they need. Leaving a rating in review is super easy and it makes a world of difference. If you are listening on Spotify, simply scroll down to the bottom of the podcast page and then tap on rate.
Erica Bennett [00:20:29]:
If you are tuning in on iTunes, head over to the podcast page, scroll down and click on write a review. It only takes a minute, but it could help someone else find this podcast and change their life. Your voice matters. Your feedback helps us grow. So take a moment to share your thoughts and experiences. Together we can help spread the word to support even more women. Thank you for being a part of this journey. Let's continue to support each other and make a difference one review at a time.
Erica Bennett [00:20:58]:
Do you, have you read the book the origins of you? I love that book.
Raquel Deluccia [00:21:01]:
Oh, I love that book. Wonderful.
Erica Bennett [00:21:03]:
I love that book, you guys. I will tag that book. I will put it down below. It's by the mindful MFT marriage and family therapist. That's her little handle. Have loved watching her content over the last like four or five years. Just really great. And the book was so cool because it gives you all these examples of these origin stories.
Erica Bennett [00:21:23]:
I love the language and how it works. So if you're looking for like, what are my origin stories and how are those stories creating the patterns that I'm dealing with every day? That is a really great tool. Now another tool, and it's actually one, I don't believe I've ever officially done this type of therapy work. But the family ifs, the internal family systems work. So let's talk a little bit about that because that is a, it's a newer type of therapy talk that I've heard. So for like the last probably couple years maybe it finally started popping up and it totally was, because Gabby Bernstein all of a sudden was like, I'm doing ifs and then what happens? The whole world goes, what is this therapy? And I'm sure it's been around a lot longer than that, but it's finally got a little bit more traction. So talk to us a little bit about ifs.
Raquel Deluccia [00:22:13]:
Sure. So that's actually what I was referring to earlier when I was talking about the different parts of you. That's the language used in ifs. So the premise, I was created, I think, about 40 years ago now by Dick Schwartz, Richard Schwartz. He's just a brilliant man. He has a book called no bad parts. Get it on audio because his voice is very melodic and he takes you through meditations. And so it's just it's a great palatable read on the subject.
Raquel Deluccia [00:22:42]:
So internal family systems looks at individuals in the sense of we are made up of a family of systems inside of us. So it's not family therapy. It's an individual therapy model. And basically what happens when we go through something really tough trauma occurs. We like the part of us that goes through it, doesn't know or can't process it. And so another part emerges, a protector part. And that younger, that wounded part gets pushed out. We call that an exile.
Raquel Deluccia [00:23:18]:
It gets exiled out of the system. It holds too many scary feelings, beliefs, and it just. We don't want that around anymore. Right? So a protector comes up. Protector can be the person or the part that plans. Very proactive. This is what I'm going to do to protect my system from experiencing these feelings. And these protectors take on extreme roles, so eventually they actually wind up not serving us anymore.
Raquel Deluccia [00:23:50]:
For instance, they will be the voice inside that says, you're not good enough. You should do better than that because it wants to protect you from actually ever feeling that way from an outside source. So some protectors are proactive, some are reactive. Those are called firefighters. That's your addiction, that's your eating disorder. That's your rage, impulsivity, sexual addiction, things like that. That tries to just calm the system down with input, with substances, with things, with buying. And so the process of therapy is, let's get to know these parts.
Raquel Deluccia [00:24:28]:
Let's get to know the parts that are running the show. Who's running the boardroom, who's at the head of the table. We want to find the self led energy. That's what it's called in ifs, who's very calm, centered, collected, confident, very even, can handle things, is responsive, can say, oh, there's my anxious part coming up. It's okay. You can have a seat here. But I'm still running the show. And the therapy work is beautiful.
Raquel Deluccia [00:24:55]:
When you talk about inner child, we would look at that in ifs as the wounded exile. And we don't just have one. They're different ages. There might be a four year old exile, ten year old, 16. There could even be like a 21 year old exile.
Erica Bennett [00:25:09]:
It's making me visualize it. And I'm so excited to go. First of all, I'm going to start the book, but then I want to do it. But I have an activity in my head I want you to imagine from the abominable snowman movie from your childhood, like the island of misfit toys. There's like an island of exiled versions of you. Like God. Go visual. Go to the island and see who you've kicked out.
Erica Bennett [00:25:31]:
Like, who have you shoved down and pushed away.
Raquel Deluccia [00:25:34]:
Yeah, because they definitely drive a lot of our habits, behaviors, negative beliefs. And so it's a beautiful thing working with clients. I have them go inside themselves and we. We find the part, and maybe there's a few at play. We can make space. If it's a really strong protector, we can ask for some space so we can get to a more vulnerable part. And the healing I've seen with this modality is just phenomenal. Like nothing I've.
Raquel Deluccia [00:26:02]:
That with EMDR. I use them together. It's just like nothing I've seen before, the. The response that clients have. So when we talk about divorce and loss, there is this part of you that, that shames you for maybe leaving, and that's the protector part or a part of you that says, you know, maybe you shouldn't have done this or you're not good enough. That's why they left you. And so we want to be able to give those parts some space and unburden them from feeling like they have to keep you down to protect you.
Erica Bennett [00:26:35]:
Those parts can be so illogical as well. Like, I felt a lot of shame during my separation. I didn't want anybody to know. You know, part of it was I didn't want anybody to know because then I don't think I felt like they would judge him. And so, you know, in my mind, when we got back together, then they're going to hold this against him. So I can't say anything. But. But when we got divorced, too, then there was this shame that I failed.
Erica Bennett [00:27:00]:
I failed at this thing that truly society says is like the mark of being a good woman. Your ability to maintain your marriage and your family and your home is still, like, the marker of what it means to be feminine. And so it didn't matter that in my instance, there was betrayal and lies. So, like, who should have really felt shamed, right? There was. There was black and white examples of, that's not what it means to be married. Like, that's very distrustful. And yet I was sitting there with the shame of, like, gosh, this really reflects on me. And because there was betrayal, it reflected on me in terms of my desirability.
Erica Bennett [00:27:42]:
Was I not beautiful enough? Was I not sexy enough? Did I not fulfill that role that you went and sought something to fill that gap? So now I can't even do that right. You know, now I can't parent right now, I. All these pieces came up. So much shame, and there shouldn't have been because I fought valiantly. We tried. It didn't work. We didn't want the same things. There was no shame in that, you know, and we didn't know.
Erica Bennett [00:28:09]:
I think the biggest part is there reaches a point when there's so much pain that it's really hard to unwind that resentment and the pain and the betrayal. Is it possible? Absolutely. I do truly believe that outside of, like, physical and emotional abuse issues. Outside of abuse issues, I believe that every marriage can be saved no matter what has happened. But it takes the work, you guys. And sometimes that work is just too big.
Raquel Deluccia [00:28:39]:
You're absolutely right.
Erica Bennett [00:28:40]:
Yeah. And it takes two people that want to do the work. Like, I was like, gung ho, let's do the work. And thank God he wasn't. What, what if he had come back and I had chosen to stay and we'd be, you know, cycling through some of the same patterns? So no matter which way it goes, there's always a reason, right. There's always a. There's always a thing that's coming that you still get to be happy either way. Well, now I'm really intrigued about that type of therapy and doing.
Erica Bennett [00:29:07]:
I am 100% writing a visualization on the island of misfit toys, and this is for real coming out. I also love it because I feel like in my world, talk therapy was very obvious. I did EMDR with a talk therapist because you had to be a licensed therapist to be able to offer EMDR. And when I, you know, quote unquote, graduated past that, you know, when all of a sudden, you know, the thing would hit and I'd need the EMDR. But it took a couple weeks to get into my next appointment because I didn't need to schedule regularly at that point. I was kind of past it by time it showed up and I knew I was moving on, then I moved into the whole world of what I would call woo healing. Right. We're talking about akashic records and astrology and past lives.
Erica Bennett [00:29:53]:
And to me, it feels like ifs is the bridge to that, you know, because you are looking at wounded children. We're not going down past lives issues, but we're looking at different energetic facets of who you are, who you were, and kind of bringing those back to life. And that stuff I love, because that's really where it got deep, you know?
Raquel Deluccia [00:30:13]:
Yes. And blending those together, I find to be super effective. You know, when we meet apart, we can just notice that with the bilateral stimulation, and that will create, you know, we try to connect with these parts and build relationship with them. I think that's that's the key, is not continuing to exile and abandon and shame and judge or hate a lot of people, you know, how do you feel about that part of you? Oh, I hate it. I hate the part of me that is still sad about this, that's still grieving. I hate that part. Right. Okay, well, we're gonna.
Raquel Deluccia [00:30:47]:
Let's let's make some space from that part that hates it so much. Can it just back up a little and can we really, you know, sit with the part that is so sad and misses their relationship?
Erica Bennett [00:30:59]:
Right.
Raquel Deluccia [00:30:59]:
And that it's it's it's game changing.
Erica Bennett [00:31:02]:
Yeah. And I love EMDR. You guys, if you're there, is a full episode on EMDR. But let's talk a little bit about it today before we kind of hit the end of the episode, because I find that that bilateral stimulation. Right. Whether you're doing EMDR, I had actually first started it on EFT, so tapping techniques, but it was this presence about this right, left, right, left, right, left. And that, for me, got that mind to then think right, left, right, left, right, left. Let it process out.
Erica Bennett [00:31:31]:
And it was where some of those deep bubbles of hidden, hidden stuff. I am gung ho to look at it and dig it out and find it. But I couldn't find them. They were hidden. I knew what was happening on the surface. I can't breathe or I'm feeling anxiety or all my stress is through the roof. And then we'd tap and we'd finally get to the root of it. You know, I love talk therapy.
Erica Bennett [00:31:54]:
Is this idea of, like, you're mowing the yard, you're mowing the weeds out with talk therapy, right. We're cleaning it up. It looks good again. It's pretty. We can play in the yard again. But those weeds, those dang dandelions, right? You got to get it by the root or they keep coming back and they just keep spreading everywhere else. So, Emdr. So tell our listeners a little bit about what it is.
Erica Bennett [00:32:16]:
How, like, why would they want to look at it or what could they hope to get from adding it into their practice?
Raquel Deluccia [00:32:23]:
Oh, sure. So, EMDR, all it stands for eye movement. Yes. Eye movement desensitization and reprocessing is the longest acronym and shouldn't be that way.
Erica Bennett [00:32:34]:
And it should be the other way. Like, it should be rapid eye movement desensitization. And it's not and every time I'm like, who named this thing?
Raquel Deluccia [00:32:45]:
So it uses bilateral stimulation. I use handheld buzzers. Some people use a light bar. Some people just use their hands or tapping of legs. Ultra, you know, one knee at a time.
Erica Bennett [00:32:57]:
Mine was knee tapping. So.
Raquel Deluccia [00:32:59]:
And the basic idea is that we're going to bypass the front part of your brain and get into the back. So we're going to get into the subcortex because we want to know what's hidden back there as far as the memories, the neural networks that weren't filed properly at the time of an event. And so they kind of act like a splinter in the skin that was never removed and that got infected. So we get to, hey, tell me about this event that occurred when your ex told you he wasn't in love with you. And let's break that down. What image is paired with that event? What negative belief is paired with that event? What emotion is there, and where does that live in your body? And how disturbing is that? Zero to ten. What we want to do is then reprocess it using bilateral stimulation to get that file stored in a more adaptive place in your brain so that you can get that disturbance to zero, which just means neutral. It doesn't mean we erase the memory.
Raquel Deluccia [00:33:57]:
It means I can look at that event, tell that story, recall that memory, and not get disturbed by it anymore. I can know it was disturbing. I can know that had a huge impact, changed my life. But I don't feel those sensations anymore. And I actually now believe that I am enough. If that was, you know, if you wanted to believe, if your negative belief was, I'm not good enough. Right. And so that's the power of it.
Raquel Deluccia [00:34:21]:
It is. It's so powerful. Some therapists do it in intensive formats where you spend hours targeting something or a few things, like 6 hours in a session with a break. I haven't done that. I haven't gone down that road.
Erica Bennett [00:34:35]:
I'm kind of intrigued. I only got to do 50 minutes at a time.
Raquel Deluccia [00:34:38]:
Yeah. So it's kind of this wave of, hey, let's make this intensive and let's knock this out in 6 hours and everybody processes differently.
Erica Bennett [00:34:48]:
Yeah, it'd be a lot.
Raquel Deluccia [00:34:50]:
It'd be a lot. It's heavy.
Erica Bennett [00:34:52]:
You'd really want to be like, hey, and I guess I would question, too, well, in the moment, you're getting through it and getting through it and getting through it. You know, the little weeds again, they grow back again. So I wonder if almost doing a little bit at a time and a little bit at a time while you, you know, like you think about. You weeded one section of your yard, did some of the neighboring section plant back over there? Yes, but like you're removing each time effectively. Interesting.
Raquel Deluccia [00:35:21]:
Yeah. So they do circle back. There is like a post. And again, this is not my area, but they will have an afterward. What's still coming up? Okay, let's dive back in. But I do like the pacing between, because our unconscious mind processes everything that came up in that event or in that session, but you don't know that it's doing that because we use resourcing at the end. We contain it. We do complace.
Raquel Deluccia [00:35:43]:
Like, you leave and you don't even remember when you come back, what we worked on usually.
Erica Bennett [00:35:47]:
Yeah. And I just found that, I know I book my therapy to, when I kidnap afterwards.
Raquel Deluccia [00:35:53]:
Oh, 100%.
Erica Bennett [00:35:54]:
I tell clients, yeah, like, it's so big and so heavy and you feel so exhausted, especially if you're clearing the big shit that then just go take a nap and allow your body and your nervous system to do the work it wants to do. It's going to reprogram it. But you need to shut off that prefrontal cortex, the logical thinking, controlling part of your brain, shut it off, and let your, like, computer system run the, run the, you know, program in the background to help you be able to truly let it go.
Raquel Deluccia [00:36:23]:
Yes. And I love EMDR for things like, you know, struggling with that co parent, because EMDR works on past, present and future, and they all blend together. So personally, things that were really difficult with my oldest son's co parent, I would have disturbances and reactions and responses to text messages, to in person meetings, whatever, and I had to do something. And so EMDR is honestly what changed the game for me on how I approach those things. Like, it shifted everything for me. And so I love using that. Now with my clients coming in just so dysregulated and, you know, dealing with whatever their ex is doing, co parent is doing. We could even target recent events.
Raquel Deluccia [00:37:09]:
It's a different protocol. It's a way to tell a story that just happened yesterday, but using the bilaterals to then find out what parts most disturbing, let's go with that one. So there's different ways to do it. If you can, you have access to it. Go find an EMDR therapist.
Erica Bennett [00:37:25]:
I love that because I used EMDR for past stuff. You know, my experience was there were reoccurring memories that would pop up or I wasn't even aware. But once we started doing the bilateral stimulation by tapping on my knees, these flashes of old memories would show up. And I would realize that in that moment, my nervous system had switched to survival mode to fight or flight. And so it didn't process, it didn't feel what needed to be felt. And so that that vision would come back up and I would just have to replay the movie and finally really feel the feels and just acknowledge that that shit was hard and that was a hard moment, and you did what you had to do. But, like, my system had gone offline. So I love this idea, too, about starting to use it for present things and for future things, because it just brings so much relief to your nervous system that, you know, to be honest, our nervous systems are running on high gear right now all the time.
Erica Bennett [00:38:22]:
Everything is fear based. Our marketing, you know what? You can't eat that. Don't eat that. It's going to kill you. Right? Like, everything is so intense all the time. So very interesting. Well, before we wrap up today, let's talk a little bit about what you have for listeners, too. So if you guys are intrigued, if you want to learn more.
Erica Bennett [00:38:42]:
Now, of course, finding an EMDR therapist, it is a certification or a license that they need. Not just anybody can pick it up and do it. So you're going to want to check either with your insurance or your local. If you have a therapist already, ask your therapist if they know somebody who has that additional certification. So that one is go find somebody who is ready and licensed to help guide you through it. But you also have another offer for listeners in case they're looking for more help.
Raquel Deluccia [00:39:09]:
Yeah. So I am in the process of beginning to launch a course that I have called evoke, which takes people through what I call the be felt method. And this is something I've created to help people develop emotional fluency, literacy, and tolerance. I just find that emotions are. I want to normalize them. Like, it's okay that we feel we're meant to feel. And I'm tired of the just societal messaging conditioning to suppress, suppress, suppress, don't feel feelings bad. Because guess what? Most of the problems I see clients come in with is because we're not feeling, we're not allowing it, or our bodies don't allow it.
Raquel Deluccia [00:39:50]:
So sometimes it's our minds, sometimes it's our bodies. So I would love to, you know, send listeners to the waitlist to, if you want to, you know, be able to get that course when it's out, come on down. Hopefully that will be end of March, early April. That is my goal.
Erica Bennett [00:40:06]:
I bet you it'll be out by time this episode airs. So we'll have the link for you guys, all the details in the show notes, and it'll also be on the crazy ex Wives club.com under episodes. So that way, Raquel, as you like, as it goes live, we can just drop that link in and then they'll be able to come over and learn from you. Because I agree. Emotional healing, that's the way to go. When you can get in control of your emotions, girl, your life becomes delightful because you no longer have to sit feeling all icky and hating and blameful and angry at the rest of the world. You just get to choose something different.
Raquel Deluccia [00:40:41]:
Yes. And if anyone is in Arizona, that's where I'm licensed to practice. I do take new clients. I'm located in Phoenix, but outside of Arizona, unfortunately, I cannot be your therapist, but I can't help you, you know, through this course, which is kind of the cool thing about these, these avenues these days.
Erica Bennett [00:40:58]:
But, yeah, wonderful. So if you're outside of Arizona, actually, if you're anywhere, you have a course. If you're in Arizona, you could actually work in person with Raquel. So all of the details are in the show notes that you guys can follow along on her journey online. You can sign up for her programs, and we'll have the link for her podcast in there as well so that you can hop over there until next week. You guys, do me a favor. Pop over and leave a review. We'd love to hear what you think about the episodes, about the show.
Erica Bennett [00:41:26]:
Make sure to share it with a friend if you're really enjoying it. It's all about spreading the word to help other people navigate all of these big transitions in their life. So we will talk to you again next week, and until then, take care. And that's it. Another great episode of The Crazy Ex-Wives Club, a podcast for women learning how to heal from their divorce. Tune in next week for more advice and tips to help you figure out life after divorce. And until then, give yourself grace. Do the best you can and know that this is all part of the process.
